Orange County Shooters
News from the Orange County NY, NY State and the Nation of interest to gun owners and sportsmen
MARCH 2006 Newsletter
2005-2006 Orange County Pistol League Final Scores 2005-2006 Orange County Pistol League Final Scores
Saturday May 20th set as date for Youth Fishing Deby Saturday May 20th set as date for Youth Fishing Derby
OCFSC/Black Rock Flea Market set for July 22 OCFSC/Black Rock Flea Market set for July 22
Great Time at the Friends of the NRA Dinner Great Time at the Friends of the NRA Dinner


OCShooters.com on 2nd Amendment Radio Show OCShooters.com on 2nd Amendment Radio Show
Five year anniversary of NY's Cobis system, five years of failure Five year anniversary of NY's Cobis system, five years of failure


National Association of Chiefs of Police's Survey shows support for gun owners National Association of Chiefs of Police's Survey shows support for gun owners
Via Arms and the Law Blog - Armed journalists in Iraq, Opinio Juris has a posting on journalists applying for gun permits in Iraq (sounds like a plan to me!) and disputing the International News Safety Institute's claim that packing in self-defense might lose them Geneva Convention protections. (The protective value of which lies in ... oh, having the INSI issue an open letter condemning your decapitation). From Arms and the Law: Hilarious pro-gun ad, Right here. Caveat: fairly big wmv medial file, but unless you have dialup, well worth it.
Another funny one from Iraq, large file so no dialup.
GYEONGGIDO SHOOTING RANGE: A not so funny one from the far east. How would you like to target shoot with your gun chained down and you have to wear a bullet proof vest?
Hawthorne anti-violence activist arrested on gun suspicion - HAWTHORNE, Calif. - The founder of an anti-gang center called "No Guns" was arrested after police said they found a gun in his home and his son, a reputed gang member nicknamed "Little Weasel," was taken into custody in connection with a home-invasion robbery. - Hector Marroquin Sr., 49, a former gang leader, was arrested Thursday for investigation of being an ex-felon in possession of a firearm, said Hawthorne police Lt. Tom Jester. Police found the gun when they raided his home looking for his son, 31-year-old Hector Marroquin Jr., Jester said.
Crackdown on animal-rights activists - New Jersey guilty verdict puts focus on extremists' tactics that Congress is trying to curb.Stop - Huntingdon Animal Cruelty (SHAC), claims its actions constitute free speech. But federal prosecutors and the jury in a Trenton, N.J., courtroom called it harassment, stalking, and conspiracy - the first such conviction under the 1992 Animal Enterprise Protection Act.
CNN.com story
'Cradle of liberty' turned 'nanny state'?, NRANEWS.com , Cam Edwards gives a speech at Tufs U in MA.
Arm private citizens, Woman, Jamaican Senator wants bureaucracy removed from gun licence application.

CoBIS or Gun "DNA" Watch

# OF CoBIS "Hits"
$20,333,333 +?

1 possible

     This is the 5 year anniversary of the program. 20,973 of the total guns were test fired at a NY State Police CoBIS Center. NY's bought an average of 2,030 new guns a month in the 60 months of the program.

06 Mar, Mon, 16:24:14 r2.courts.state.ny.us 13 Mar, Mon, 12:54:40 cutthroats.ucdavis.edu
07 Mar, Tue, 08:37:27 tias-gw2.treas.gov 15 Mar, Wed, 0x:0x:xx xxx.nyc.gov
17 Mar, Fri, 08:19:55 azwp09-o.wellsfargo.com 30 Mar, Thu, 12:23:12 xxxx.federalreserve.org
31 Mar, Fri, xx:xx: xxx.tiffany.com  
29 Mar, Wed, 19:12:46 http://www.google.com/search?=how+long+will+i+go+to+jail+if+i+own+a+handgun+without+a+permit+in+ny


     Your NRA magazine for March contains the ballot for the 2006 NRA Directors. It is important that you fill it out and mail it in this year! The ballot must be received by the NRA by April 30th so you have plenty of time.
     Why is it so important this year to vote? Because several NY's are in the running for a Board of Directors spot and need your support. All of them have spend much of their time supporting your rights and promoting the shooting sports.
      They are:

#8 Tom King
East Greenbush, NY
     Tom King is the head of the New York State Rifle and Pistol Association and it is important that we have his voice on the NRA Board. Everyone should be aware of how hard he has worked as President of the NYSRPA to keep the rights that we have in NY and to expand them. The NYSRPA is the NRA's NY State Affiliated Association. CLICK HERE FOR MORE INFO
#12 Amy Heath
New York City
Amy Heath and Wayne
     Amy Heath is one of the most active women in the shooting sports in the NY and the nation. She has made numerous TV appearances defending your rights and organized the first ever "Women on Target" program and Women's Shooting League in NYC. Because she lives in NY City, she is the "go to" person for the morning TV shows when they need someone to explain something about guns. Hunter, SASS member, NRA instructor, former Documentary Associate Producer:  A&E TV Networks, History Channel, Biography... CLICK HERE FOR MORE INFO   
Speaking of the "Women on Target," here is an article in the The Birmingham News about it.
#29 David O. Boehm
Rochester, NY
     David O. Boehm is up for re-election to the Board. A retired NY State Appellate Court Justice, he now works for the law firm of Harris Beach.
 Also vote for Current NRA First Vice President, (#22,) Captain John C. Sigler (Ret.). As 1st VP for the NRA he spends 100 % of his time supporting your rights across the nation and he has traveled to NY many times in support of your rights and has spoken at many local events in the state.





     The Middletown, Times Herald-Record published in the "MY VIEW" section and opinion that Mike Kubow, Chairman for the Orange County Chapter of SCOPE and I wrote. After missing the e-mail for a few days, when I talked to them on the phone they told me to send it in again and I did and they published it 5 days latter on Sunday no less, March 26, 2006. As far as I can tell, they did not change one word. They do not have it on their web site but I will call Monday and see if they will put in a link. The following is the article:


     NY has some of the most repressive gun laws of any state including an Assault Weapons Ban and registration of all handguns but that is not good enough for anti-gun Sheldon Silver, and anti-gun rights groups. Several bills, some written by gun haters from Washington D. C. and California, have passed the NY Assembly that would have a severe impact on gun owners and close all gun stores in NY.
     One bill requires all gun stores to close if they do not have a million dollar insurance policy that does not exist and will never be offered by insurance companies. Another bill requires that guns have a 10 lb trigger pull but the worse bill is the new “Assault Weapons Ban” that would require registration of many common rifles and shotguns and end the sale of new firearms that fit this very broad definition and totally ban many competition handguns.
     How broad is this definition? So broad that handguns used in Olympic Competition would be declared “Assault Weapons” and illegal to possess even if you already own these guns. These are not cheep, high capacity big caliber guns that are banned. These are 22 caliber competition guns costing more than two thousand dollars that only hold 5 rounds and are too big and heavy to use for concealed carry. It is as silly as calling a javelin or shot-put used in Olympic competition an “Assault Weapon.”
     Their goal is not to control gun crime because the bills do not punish criminals; in fact Sheldon Silver deleted death penalty language from a recent bill that punished criminals who kill police. Their goal is to end all private gun ownership one-step at a time. When NY’s AWB passed it was only anti-gun people like NY Senator Schneiderman who said: " I am disappointed that this bill doesn't do more." ... There are a lot of nasty weapons ... that we should be banning."
     Those "Nasty Weapons" include many hunting and competition guns. Gone are the anchors of past “Assault Weapons” definitions, that the guns have a bayonet lug or grenade launcher. Now a gun with bayonet lug or grenade launcher will not be an “Assault Weapon” but any semi-automatic or pump 22 caliber with a thumbhole stock or pistol grip will be an “Assault Weapon” and will have to be registered.
     We don’t know how much this new long gun registration scheme will cost but NY City first registered all long guns for a small fee of $25 then started raising fees so it now cost $140 for a 3-year license and after several years, certain long guns, even if they were registered, were banned. NY City Handgun licenses cost $344 every three years and are not valid in the rest of NY State.
     Some Police Chiefs from across NY were tricked into signing a petition supporting these bills because the petition did not including any information about the bills. Chief Carl Schupp from Blooming Grove, Acting Chief Peter Graziano from Chester, Chief Matthew Byrne from Middletown, Chief Michael C. Biasotti from New Windsor, Chief Daniel J. Carlin from Tuxedo and Chief Robert J. Kwiatkowski from Woodbury all signed a petition that would adversely impact your gun rights.
     Gun control supports say they are not after our hunting guns but by changing the definition, many target and hunting guns will magically become “Assault Weapon.” This new long gun registry and handgun ban is just another step in their effort to bring New York City gun laws, bans and confiscation to the rest of New York State.

A big thanks to Mike Kubow, Chairman of the Orange County Chapter of SCOPE
for his help with this article.


     It is important that other people write in support of our article or send in letters to their local paper. The Chiefs who signed the petition should be focused on for signing onto bills that they did not know anything about and that they are supporting Sheldon Silver who does not support the police. We should demand that they request that their name be removed from the petition list and bring this up to every elected officials that you can find.
     One person did call to say that NY City handgun licenses are valid across the state. THIS IS NOT TRUE. NY City only issues premise licenses. The following is from a letter that I got from the NY City Police Department: "... a premise license issued by the New York City Police Department is limited as to place of possession, and therefore would not be valid outside the licensed premises. ... New York City Police Department no longer issues target licenses ..." For more information and a full copy of the letter go to my December 2002 newsletter.
      Please put together a "Letter To The Editor" in support of our letter and go to my website, OCShooters.com for more information. http://www.ocshooters.com/newsletters/06/01.htm#assembly
     Check http://www.ocshooters.com/newsletters/05/06.htm#nyagbawb to see if your local Chief signed the petition that NYAGV sent out. Again, NYAGV's petition did not contain any information about the true impact of the bill and when I asked, NYAGV said that it was up to each Chief to look up the bill and find out what was in it. I have called several of the people who signed the bill and have yet to find one who knew anything about the details of the bill. (Jackie Kuhls, head of NYAGV characterized my wanting to question the Chiefs who signed the petition without knowing what they were supporting as "harassment" when I talked to her.) I will update my website with a special report next week.
      As we attempt to get information out, we are limited by space that they will publish and you can bring up additional points that we could not cover. I have some suggestions but feel free to do what ever you want. We cannot do anything to prevent these bills from passing the NY Assembly but we can contact the local Chiefs and let them know that we know when they add their support to laws that will take our rights away. Please contact your local Chief and if they signed the petition ask them to take their name off and contact your local Mayor or any other local official. If you Chief did not sign the Petition please still contact them and let them know not to sign the petition. Please e-mail me with any information that you find out and see if you can get a copy of the petition. I called New Yorkers Against Gun Violence and they refused to send me a copy.

  • The anti-gun T H-R fails in its obligation to report on news about gun related issues such as the impact of new proposed laws, and the T H-R fails to report pro-gun news or any pro-gun success.
  • The Anti-gunners ARE after our hunting and target guns!
  • The laws punish honest gun owners and will make criminals out of them. (Who would ever think a Ruger 10/22 with a thumbhole stock would be an "Assault Weapon"or a Hämmerli 280 or SP20 or similar handgun would be an "Assault Weapon" and ownership totally banned along with any simi-auto handgun with a muzzle brake or muzzle compensator!)
  • Sheldon Silver does not want to pass laws that punish criminals.
  • Sheldon Silver does not support the police.
  • Would it not be more logical to increase the penalty when criminals use these guns in the commission of a crime?
  • We do use these guns in hunting and target shooting.

2005-2006 Orange County Pistol League Final Scores 2005-2006 Orange County Pistol League Final Scores

     March, 21st was the final date of this seasons Orange County Pistol League with Dutchess County winning the top spot by a nice margin.
    The OCPL shoots 60 rounds of 22 Cal. at Master Class in Monroe on every other Tuesday night starting in October and ending in the following March or April, skipping several weeks for holidays, for a total of 12 dates. Anyone can join no matter what your skill level is and it only takes about one hour. Call Master Class in September for more information and CLICK HERE for more information and the course of fire.
     Team scores are calculated by adding the 4 highest scores from members of shooting on each team. 60 rounds are fired with 600 with 60 X being a perfect score for each event.
     Rich B. took top honors with an average score of 577, 193 X and 96% score. The lowest shooter shot an average score of 414 with a 69% average. As you can tell from the range of scores, shooters of all skill levels are welcome. (With my elbow, shoulder problems I was only able to get an average of 499 with a 83% ave.)

Top 4 shooters
Ave team score
Out of 600
Monroe Chester
Black Rock

     Master Class is going to have a SUMMER "L" COURSE LEAGUE every Wednesday Night starting May 3rd, 2006 and running until August 3rd, 2006. Only the top 10 scores count so you can have "do over's." It will be a center fire league with 60 shots at 25 yards. All are welcome.

Saturday May 20th set as date for Youth Fishing Deby Saturday May 20th set as date for Youth Fishing Derby

     The Orange County Federation of Sportsmens Clubs, Inc. has announce that it will be holding the 2nd Annual Rudy Vallet Memorial Youth Fishing Derby on Saturday May, 20th starting at 10:00 AM. It is free for the kids between 5 to 14 and will be held at the Shawangunk Fish And Game Club off of Rt. 17 M, Middletown, NY. Lots of prizes will be given away and free hotdogs and sodas for the kids.


OCFSC/Black Rock Flea Market set for July 22 OCFSC/Black Rock Flea Market set for July 22

     The Orange County Federation of Sportsmens Clubs, Inc. has announce that it will be holding a Flea Market at Black Rock on July 22nd. Both inside and outside tables will be available and they will have free parking. Food will also be available. Tables are not limited to /hunting/fishing related items so you can bring anything that you want to bring.

     We hope that you will be able to attend. OCShooters will have a table.

Great Time at the Friends of the NRA Dinner Great Time at the Friends of the NRA Dinner

   Everyone had lots of fun and good food that this years Friends of the NRA Dinner in Middletown on March 4th, especially those who won guns and other prizes. We gave away a lot of guns and many other prizes and we had the largest number of Silent Auction items we have ever had. We also had many great Auction items. I will let some of the pictures speak for themselves. If you were not able to attend, please try to attend next year's Friends of the NRA Dinner and the Orange County Federation Dinner this Fall. All of the money at the Friends of the NRA Dinner goes to the NRA Foundation and half of the money stays in NY and is given as grants to clubs and groups in NY to promote Education and the Shooting Sports.

Lots of good food

Wall of Gun Winners

     These are just a few of this years winners. I will make a photo Album of the event soon. If you want your picture just send me an e-mail and I will sent you the full size file.


OCShooters.com on 2nd Amendment Radio Show OCShooters.com on 2nd Amendment Radio Show

Hosts Ralph Esposito and Radio Fred at the WASB studio.
Hosts Ralph Esposito and
Radio Fred at the WASB studio.
     I was on the 2nd Amendment Radio show on 3/30/06. The weekly 1 1/2 hour radio show is based out of WASB 1590 AM - Brockport, NY, and WRSB 1310 AM - Canandaigua, NY and you can download the show from the internet HERE. It is the only state wide radio show in NY and the only one in the nation as far as I have found. The show is supported by several pro-gun groups and you can expect to hear pro-gun supporters and leaders from across NY and the nation each week. Some of the regular guest are Ken Mathison, the head of SCOPE; Tom King, the head of NYSRPA and Larry Pratt, the head of GOA; various other people from the NRA and other groups across the nation. They also have time for other guest representing various government branches like County Clerks, the military, the police are just a few.

Five year anniversary of NY's Cobis system, five years of failure Five year anniversary of NY's Cobis system, five years of failure

     The numbers are in for the first 5 years of NY State's CoBIS or Combined Ballistic Identification System program and now we know that 121,853 new handguns were sold in NY State and were registered with the program and somewhere between 15.5 to 28 Million Dollars was spent. What did we get for our money? No "hits" were made using the original CoBIS system but in the last year, a way around the Federal ban of linking NY State's CoBIS program with the Federal National Integrated Ballistic Identification Network program using a back-up tape provide some results. Using the NIBIN data collected from know crimes, a grand total of two times the system provided a link between a gun used in a crime and the person who owned bought the gun new in NY. Both cases also came from the same location, Rochester.
     Never heard of the hits, missed the banner on the capital building in Albany, the press releases from DCJS and New Yorkers Against Gun Violence? That is because they don't want the information to come out about the "hits" because both of them show was a waste of time and money the program is. I have sent in Freedom of Information Acts request and have not gotten anything back but the rumor, (that I will correct if I ever find out the truth,) is that the first hit was of shell casings found on the street after a "shots fired" call. No one was hurt but by the time the shell casing found its way through the NIBIN program and by the time a match was found, the statue of limitations had run out on this misdemeanor crime but in the mean time the person who owned the gun had already been in trouble and his handgun had been taken away while his license was being suspended/revoked.
     Hit number two, (2,) just happened in Dec. of 2005 again in Rochester using NIBIN data. Again the person was already in trouble, (again according to the rumors,) and his license had been suspended/revoked however the police never went by to pick up the person's gun. When the police, prompted by the hit finally went to the suspect to get the gun when they asked the suspect where he kept the gun, he told them and when the police when to look the gun was gone. When the police told the suspect that the gun was gone all he said was that the gun must have been stolen and he wanted to report a stolen gun.

Some of the numbers:

      Dollars spent:
    In the budget $4,000,000 a year plus $4,000,000 set up cost = $28,000,000 or $230 per gun.
    DCJS claim, $14,700,000 or $121 per gun

     State Police Man Hours = 15 people at 2,080 MH per year =31,200 per year * 5 years = 156,000 total so far or 1.3 MH per gun.

     I know of two bills that they could pass. 1. Require that police take the guns of the people who have had their pistol license suspended or revoked within 24 hours. 2. Require that those guns be test fired and the shell case sent to directly to CoBIS and NIBIN within 78 hours.


National Association of Chiefs of Police's Survey shows support for gun owners National Association of Chiefs of Police's Survey shows support for gun owners


     The National Association of Chiefs of Police, representing over 60,000 members across the nation conducted it's Annual Survey and questions were posed by mail of 22,587 Chiefs of Police and Sheriffs in the United States. The RESULTS OF THE SURVEY are in and the survey revealed that 93 percent of chiefs and sheriffs felt that citizens should be able to purchase firearms for sport and self defense; 73 percent opposed so-called "one gun a month" laws; 96 percent believed that criminals ignore gun control laws and; 63 percent supported laws that allow citizens to carry defensive firearms as a means to control crime.


Times Herald-Record
O C Shooters