Orange County Shooters
News from the Orange County NY, NY State and the Nation of interest to gun owners and sportsmen
SEPTEMBER 2003 Newsletter


OCFSC's Annual Dinner looks like the biggiest yet.OCFSC's Annual Dinner looks like the biggest yet.
DEC Hunter Education locations in Orange County DEC Hunter Education locations in Orange County
Orange County Sheriff's Department makes changes to Pistol Application Orange County Sheriff's Department makes changes to Pistol Application
Orange County Pistol League news. Orange County Pistol League news.


Pataki VETOS 3 bills, Pataki VETOS 3 bills, "CANNED SHOOT", "TRAP ID", "BLAZED ORANGE"
Gunning for re-election Gunning for re-election


Handgun Control's latest BEAR ALERT Handgun Control's latest BEAR ALERT
Gun report's worth at issue Misleading, ATF says of findingsGun report's worth at issue Misleading, ATF says of findings
Gun quote from Sen. John Kerry's Kerry Announcement Speech Gun quote from Sen. John Kerry's Kerry Announcement Speech

NYC'S LATEST GUN MISFIRES , By JOHN R. LOTT, JR. NY Post opinion article outlining how stupid the proposed changes in the NYC's gun laws are. The new laws are in response to the shooting death of City Councilman James E. Davis.

by Jacob J. Rieper, Legislative Director New York State Rifle & Pistol Association

OCFSC's Annual Dinner looks like the biggiest yet.OCFSC's Annual Dinner looks like the biggest yet.

OCFSC 02 Dinner   It looks like this years Federation Dinner is going to be one of the best yet. Several of the major Manufactures have said that they are going to donate some things for door prizes and many of the local stores and groups have been generous in their donations. Add that to what the Federation buys and the "Table of Guns" raffle and it sounds like almost everyone is going to walk away with some type of prize.
     Over 100 people have signed up already and some of the local politicians are going to attend.


DEC Hunter Education locations in Orange County DEC Hunter Education locations in Orange County

     The DEC has a list of all of the location for the Hunter Education classes that are required before you can buy your hunting, bowhunting or trapping license. I have made a page that list the Orange County locations and has a link to the DEC's main web page that list all of the classes for all of the counties in NY. The classes are free and even if you do not hunt, it is a good class to attend and if you want to hunt in the future you will have to take the class anyway.


August 30-31, 2003

Rifles at Civil War Weekend at Monroe, NY.     They had a great turnout for the annual Civil War Weekend at Museum Village in Monroe, NY. If you have never been to one take some time next year to go. If you like cannons, black powder or the Civil War you will get a big kick out of it. Don't forget to bring a kid. Sit down and eat a hotdog or hamburger while you watch a battle.


Orange County Sheriff's Department makes changes to Pistol Application Orange County Sheriff's Department makes changes to Pistol Application

     The Orange County Sheriff's Department has made some changes to the Pistol Application paperwork. They now require that the "REFERENCE LETTER" be notarized, and they added an "ARREST AFFIDAVIT" that also must be notarize. If you have an old application you can download the new forms from my web site or get new forms from the Pistol Permit Section. You must have the new forms. These new requirements are not major and I was against them until I was told the reason why the changes were made.
      "REFERENCE LETTER" The Sheriff's Department started calling those listed on the letter and some of the people who had signed the letter for someone said that they did not remember signing the letter or that they really did not know the person. That forced the Sheriff's Department to have to kick back the application and that happen enough that it was decided that the forms would have to be notarized to help the person remember that he/she signed it and that they should not sign it if they did not mean it.
     "ARREST AFFIDAVIT" The application requires that you list all of your arrest. Some people thought that because they were arrested and the records were sealed or that the charges were dropped or they were found not guilty, then they did not have to list the arrest. When the arrest showed up the the applicant would try an excuse that the record was sealed or other reasons. This form is to make the point that you have to list EVERY ARREST, no matter how it turned out.

Orange County Pistol League news. Orange County Pistol League news.

     Orange County Pistol LeagueThe Orange County Pistol League members have had their first meeting and have announced that the league's first event will be held on Oct. 14 at Master Class Shooters Supply in Monroe, NY. The league holds 12 events starting in October and ending in March with no shoots during the holidays. Awards are given out at the annual dinner held after the league's last event. Awards are given for team standings, individual high scores, individual ranking and other categories. Cost this year will be $110 for all 12 events and that includes awards.
     The pistol league is the largest league in Orange County and is one of the oldest if not theOrange County Pistol League oldest. You need a 22 cal. handgun of any type thought semi-autos are preferred with many outfitted with red dot sights. We shoot the NRA Gallery Course twice so you only need 60 rounds. It is fun and normally only takes about an hour or so on Tuesday nights. Don't worry that you might not be good enough, most of the people shooting in the league learned to shoot by shooting the NRA Gallery Course. (The first time I shot it I was at Dutchess County and I ended up at shooting some other guys target, but what did I know.). The first line starts around 4:30 with the next line starting an hour apart unless the line of 10 shooters is full. It takes about 1/2 hour to shoot and 1/2 to score. Click here for more info, the rules, the course of fire.
     If you want to join the league contact Master Class and they will give you the information you need. If you are a member of a club you might be able to join your club's team and anyone can always join the Master Class team. (If I could get 5 or 6 people I could have an team, just send me an e-mail.) Last year the top Pleasantville won by only 9 points over the Middletown Pistol and Rifle Club, (MPRA,) out of 26,436 total points scored.


Pataki VETOS 3 bills, Pataki VETOS 3 bills, "CANNED SHOOT", "TRAP ID", "BLAZED ORANGE"

      Gov. Mario Pataki vetoed 3 bills of interest to sportsmen. (It is good to know that he can do something right sometimes.) The "CANNED SHOOT" act would have banned hunting in all game preserves no matter how large they were and had many other flaws. The "TRAP ID" bill was suppose to end the requirement that trappers put their name and address on each trap and allow the DEC to issue an ID number that the DEC would look up when requested to do so. The reason this change was requested was that anit-trappers have been taking the information off of traps and then harassing the trappers, even posting the name and hone number of the trapper so that people from across the county can place phone calls to the trappers at all times during the day and night. It would have been a good change but the rumor is that at the lat moment the bill was changed without any one knowing in ways that were not accepted by the trappers and they had requested that the bill be withdrawn. The "BLAZED ORANGE" bill would have required that you wear 500 sq. inches of blaze orange any time you were hunting for anything. That is a lot of sq inches to ware and birds see in color so that would have been a problem.

  • VETO MESSAGE - No.134 The "CANNED SHOOT" act. - Senate Bill Number 2735-A, entitled: "AN ACT to amend the environmental conservation law, in relation to the prohibition on canned shoots"
          This bill would amend the Environmental Conservation Law (ECL) provision which forbids the taking of non-native big game mammals for a fee by means of a "canned shoot." Current law prohibits the hunting of " a non-native big game mammal that is confined in a box, pen, cage or similar container of ten or less contiguous acres from which there is no means for such mammal to escape." This bill would remove the ten-acre limitation from the definition of canned shoots and, therefore, prohibit hunting within any area enclosed by a fence, no matter how large.
  • VETO MESSAGE - No. 136 Senate Bill Number S1068A- Wright- Trap identification Bill entitled: "AN ACT to amend the environmental conservation law, in relation to identification of traps set for the taking of wildlife"
         This bill would permit the Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC) to determine what information must be contained on tags used to label wild animal traps. Current law requires that traps set for the taking of wildlife bear the name and residence address of the operator.
  • VETO MESSAGE - No. 137 S1977A Blazed Orange. Senate Bill Number 1977-A, entitled: "AN ACT to amend the environmental conservation law, in relation to requiring certain persons hunting for deer to wear fluorescent orange outer garments"
          This bill would require every person hunting game of any kind during the regular big-game season to wear "blaze orange” garments to avoid accidental shootings. Hunters would be required to wear a hat or cap of solid or patterned fluorescent orange material and/or an outer garment above the waist of a minimum total of 500 square inches of such fluorescent orange material.

Gunning for re-election Gunning for re-election
The Buffalo News, Sunday, June 29, 2003

     No one prepares for a race against Jimmy Griffin quite like South Council Member Mary Martino.
     Martino recently finished one of those FBI citizen awareness seminars, an eight-week program focusing on everything from anti-terrorism tactics to sniffing out spies.
     While with the FBI, Martino tested her reflexes and reactions as she tracked down imaginary bad guys in an FBI simulation room. She also spent time at the shooting range, where she practiced firing an automatic rifle, a Glock and a 12-gauge shotgun. One gullet-ridden target hangs proudly in Martion's 15th floor City Hall office.
     Could all this training foreshadow her run for re-election this year?
     Keep in mind, insiders are forecasting a noisy row between Martino and Griffin, the former four-term mayor.
     "Hey, you've got to be prepared for anything," she said with a laugh.
     We've heard about the rough-and-toumble politics of South Buffalo, but isn't this taking things a bit too far?

  I called and talked to Martino and she said that she did not know that what she was doing was against NY state law. The FBI have never called me back.

Handgun Control's latest BEAR ALERT Handgun Control's latest BEAR ALERT
Protect DC Gun Victims' Rights/OPPOSE Craig Amendment

NRA Board Member, Senator Larry Craig of Idaho, is planning an amendment to the DC appropriations bill to prevent the city from continuing a lawsuit against reckless gun sellers who have acted irresponsibly and created a public nuisance by funneling their guns to criminals and juveniles.


      Please call your Senators TODAY and urge them to oppose this dangerous amendment that would take away the right’s of gun victims to have their day in court.
      Tell your Senator to OPPOSE the Craig amendment that would prevent the District of Columbia from continuing its lawsuit against gun sellers. Congress should not interfere with the city's efforts to protect its citizens from gun violence.
      You can reach your Senators by calling the Capitol Switchboard: 1-800-839-5276

Gun report's worth at issue Misleading, ATF says of findingsGun report's worth at issue Misleading, ATF says of findings

Federal officials have called misleading a report by a national gun-control group that lists 10 gun dealers, including one in Chesterfield County, among the nation's worst in selling guns linked to crimes.
     Using government statistics, the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence this month released a list of licensed gun sellers it regards as "the worst players in the gun industry - gun sellers that recklessly operate their businesses and allow criminals to get guns." The group cited Southern Police Equipment at 7609 Midlothian Turnpike as the third-worst in the nation. The Brady campaign says it compiled its "bad apple" list by analyzing data maintained by the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives for 1989 through 1996. But the ATF appeared to question the Brady campaign's conclusions in a statement issued July 16, the same day as the Brady report. An ATF spokesman in Washington also wondered whether the 7- to 14-year- old data - the government data used by the Brady campaign and apparently the most recent available - was still relevant in 2003.
     " It is misleading to suggest that a gun dealer is corrupt because a large percentage of the guns sold in his store are subsequently used in a crime," the ATF said. "Many other factors - including high volume of sales, the type
of inventory carried and whether the gun [dealer] is located in a high crime area - contribute to the percentages cited by the Brady campaign." Furthermore, "the statistics cited do not provide a complete picture of the types of activities that might warrant federal gun prosecutions," the ATF said. " Gun traces [of weapons used in crimes], for example, indicate only that a gun has come to the attention of law enforcement. They do not automatically implicate a dealer or purchaser in any wrongdoing." The ATF added: "[T]he fact is that the majority of federally licensed firearms dealers are not knowingly engaged in criminal activity."
      Karen Allan, owner of Southern Police Equipment, said the Brady campaign is deliberately distorting the facts to further its gun-control agenda. " It's total slander to us," Allan said. "I also got in contact with some of the other people on the list, and everybody feels the same way we do about it. " What Brady is trying to do, of course, is take all the guns off the street," Allan added. "They're always attacking us in any way they can attack us, and we're not doing anything illegal." Allan said her gun sales records with the ATF and the state of Virginia are " impeccable."
" They have used me as a model before to train other gun shops how to do it," said Allan, who in the mid-1980s assisted ATF agents in apprehending gunrunners who came to her store. Her contribution was cited in a Washington Post story at the time. Allan said the statistics cited by the Brady campaign "didn't even represent 1 percent of the guns that we sold in those years - and they did not have the laws that they have today. " Today, everything's changed," she said. "They have the one-gun-per-month [law], they have instant criminal background checks [of potential gun buyers], and we support all of that."
     Rob Wilcox, a national spokesman for the Brady group, said the list highlights those gun dealers that have "lousy track records," and the numbers of crime guns traced to those dealers speak for themselves. " I wouldn't say we're ever suggesting that [these dealers] are selling guns [directly] to criminals," Wilcox said. "What we're saying very specifically is that there are crime guns being traced back to their stores, and for the entire country the most crime guns were traced back to these stores." Wilcox added that more than 50 percent of guns traced to crime come from less than 2 percent of the nation's gun dealers. "I think that they are doing things that are irresponsible," he said. The Brady campaign released the list as part of its lobbying effort to defeat a Senate bill that would prohibit "civil liability actions from being brought or continued against manufacturers, distributors, dealers, or importers of firearms or ammunition for damages resulting from the misuse of their products by others." In its news release, the gun-control lobby says the legislation "would send bad apples [in the gun industry] a loud message that their reckless behavior is not only acceptable, but a protected privilege."
     ATF spokesman Tom Hill noted that large-volume gun dealers "probably will have more traces" of guns used in crimes than smaller ones. " That doesn't [necessarily] mean the dealer is committing a crime," Hill explained. "It just means they're selling more guns." A gun sold legally by a dealer can end up in the wrong hands through no fault of the dealer. Guns used in crimes frequently are stolen from the original buyers or obtained through "straw purchases," a process in which people are hired to buy guns that are later resold on the street. According to ATF data analyzed by the Brady campaign, Southern Police Equipment in Chesterfield sold 447 guns traced to crime between 1989 and 1996. Of those, 293 had a "short time to crime," as defined by the ATF, the group said. The guns were involved in at least 25 homicides, 32 assaults, four robberies and 386 additional gun crimes, the Brady campaign said. In addition, the dealer sold at least 35 handguns in multiple sales, the group said. The report doesn't take into account that people could legally buy multiple handguns in Virginia before 1993. In February of that year, the General Assembly - in an effort to curb gunrunning - approved a one-handgun-per- month limit, which at the time was considered one of the toughest firearms laws in the country.
      In its report, the Brady campaign tied a 1990-91 Virginia gunrunning case to Southern Police Equipment, although the dealer was never implicated criminally in the operation. In December 1993, Ian Ralph Blackstock, a convicted drug dealer from New York, pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court to charges of obtaining guns through "straw purchases" at seven gun shops, including three in the Richmond area. The weapons, some of which were purchased at Southern Police Equipment, were resold on the streets of Washington and New York City, authorities said. According to evidence, Blackstock hired five men to make the purchases and provided them transportation to gun shops in Chesterfield, Prince William County, Petersburg and Fredericksburg. He told the men which guns to buy and gave them money for the purchases. There was no evidence presented during Blackstock's trial that Southern Police Equipment conspired with Blackstock or knowingly sold guns to his operatives.

Contact Mark Bowes at (804) 649-6450 or

Gun quote from Sen. John Kerry's Kerry Announcement Speech Gun quote from Sen. John Kerry's Announcement Speech

     "And courage means standing up for gun safety, not retreating from the issue out of political fear or trying to have it both ways. I’m a hunter and I believe in the Second Amendment but I’ve never gone hunting with an AK-47. Our party will never be the choice of the NRA -- and I’m not looking to be the candidate of the NRA." Sen. John Kerr's announcement speech that he is running to be President. Odd that he did not repeat this in his second announcement speech at Faneuil Hall.
   Yea, him and UpChuck Schumer, fighting to protect our gun rights. I will go along with him on this one. We need a federal program to turn in all AK-47s and SKS's and trade them for AR-15s and M-16s, (your choice.)


Times Herald-Record
O C Shooters